Bug#782264: grub-install fails in nested LVM

[Pierre-Elliott Bécue]

Hey,

First, I'd like to apologize for the way I asked for a fix or any solution
in that issue. I realize that it was inappropriate.

Le mercredi 23 mars 2016 à 14:56:01+0000, Ian Jackson a écrit :
> Pierre-Elliott Bécue writes ("Re: Bug#782264: grub-install fails in nested LVM"):
> > Anyway, I was more concerned by the non-ack of my report.
> 
> You received an ack of your report from the bug tracking system.
> 
> But it seems that you are concerned that this bug is not getting
> enough human attention.  That is quite possibly true.  Debian as a
> whole has too much work to do with too few people.  Maintainers have
> to choose which packages and which bug reports are going to receive
> their attention.

That's true, but I got used to see at least a human ack on bug reports, that
does not imply any commitment to solve the issue, but that is a way to say
that not only an automatized system received the report.

Maybe I should not get used to that human interaction, but I beleive that it
is exactly what makes a community, and that's what I thought I saw in the
social contract.

> Maintainers will try to work on those tasks which they think will give
> the biggest gain for the lowest effort.  Or - as volunteers - which
> they think are most fun.

That's fair.

> To try to escalate the priority of a bug you are interested in, by
> sending content-free pings, is rude.  Debian contributors should
> ignore a submitter who behaves in that way.

My apologies if that's what I made anybody think. My point was not to
escalate the priority of this bug but really to see a human being at the
other end.

> As a user, or a bug submitter, you do not have a right to a fix.

That's true, and I clearly shouldn't have been that though in my second and
third mail for this bug. Again, I'd like to apologize.

> You do not even have a right to a reply from a human.

I'm not sure to agree with that.

As far as I understood, -- and let me be clear, I *know* that I know less
about Debian than you do --, Debian, by its social contract, intends, as a
community, to focus on users needs and on the fact that nothing is made to
be hidden. In my opinion, there is no community if there is no human
interaction.

As someone becomes maintainer of a package, I'm keen on beleiving that he
chose to, and that he agrees to provide user support regarding the package
(not the software). In a public project, that relies on a community concept,
it appears to me as a very bad move to say "the automatized response is
enough", or to say "I do not have to make user support".

I have no right, but I beleive that there is commitment from a maintainer to
provide support (not fixes, just say that I'm not speaking in the wind). If
I'm wrong, -- and I guess that's your point --, then I'm sorry that I
misbeleived about Debian concept and philosophy.

> If you are dissatisfied with the progress of the work to investigate
> and fix a bug, then the Debian maintainainers will generally welcome
> your constructive help.  In this case that probably means: Feel Free
> To (Investigate And) Submit A Patch.
>
> If neither you nor your friends have the skills to work on the bug
> yourselves, and you would like to ensure you have a right to a reply
> to your emails and bug reports, I suggest you employ someone (an
> individual or a company), on a commercial basis, to provide you with
> the support you require.

I'm not dissatisfied with the progress of the work, I was dissatisfied with
the silence around my report, which seemed like "burying" the issue.

As you can see, I made a lot of investigations, especially to make sure that
the bug was really in the Debian package, but I did not succeed in finding
the exact issue, since I'm not able to reproduce the same behaviour with
bare grub2 software. I guess the issue is hidden in Debian patches, but I've
no proof of that, and not enough skills in that part of packaging to
bissect.

That was in my opinion a good move to ask someone who knows for some help.
The support could have been a simple ack, but at least, I'd have reached a
human.

Anyway, sorry, I shouldn't have been aggressive. I'll try again to find the
exact issue when I'll have some time to.

Cheers,

-- 
PEB