[Pkg-javascript-devel] Help: nodejs 16 need node-acorn source to break bootstrapping loop

[Jérémy Lal]

Le ven. 3 déc. 2021 à 10:48, Jonas Smedegaard <jonas at jones.dk> a écrit :

> Quoting Pirate Praveen (2021-12-03 07:17:12)
> >
> >
> > 2021, ഡിസംബർ 3 8:38:53 AM IST, "Jérémy Lal" <kapouer at melix.org>ൽ എഴുതി
> > >Le ven. 3 déc. 2021 à 04:05, Pirate Praveen <praveen at onenetbeyond.org>
> a
> > >écrit :
> > >
> > >> 2021, ഡിസംബർ 2 7:22:02 AM IST, "Jérémy Lal" <kapouer at melix.org>ൽ
> > >> എഴുതി
> > >> >Le jeu. 2 déc. 2021 à 02:02, Pirate Praveen
> > >> ><praveen at onenetbeyond.org> a écrit :
> > >> >> 2021, ഡിസംബർ 1 9:52:45 PM IST, "Jérémy Lal" <kapouer at melix.org>ൽ
> > >> >> എഴുതി
> > >> >> >Le mer. 1 déc. 2021 à 16:41, Pirate Praveen
> > >> >> ><praveen at onenetbeyond.org> écrit :
> > >> >> >> 2021, ഡിസംബർ 1 5:18:25 PM IST, "Jérémy Lal"
> > >> >> >> <kapouer at melix.org>ൽ എഴുതി
> > >> >> >> >To work around the bootstrapping issue that is posed by the
> > >> >> >> >huge loop of build-dependencies: nodejs -> node-acorn ->
> > >> >> >> >rollup -> zillion things -> nodejs, it is possible to make a
> > >> >> >> >stage 1 nodejs build that loads node-acorn *source* files,
> > >> >> >> >instead of the compiled ones.
> > >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> If nodejs 16 can handle acorn source files (ES6) directly,
> > >> >> >> can we just skip the build of acorn ? So we can drop nodejs
> > >> >> >> build dependency.
> > >> >> >>
> > >> >> >yes, it can be skipped, for stage 1 build.
> > >> >> >But the configuration options used for that build are not
> > >> >> >supported by upstream for anything else than development, and
> > >> >> >it has a non-negligible impact on nodejs initial load time.
> > >> >> >So as soon as node-acorn can be built (by rollup), normal
> > >> >> >nodejs build must be done.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> I'm suggesting we ship node-acorn as ES6 source only (remove
> > >> >> build steps from current node-acorn itself) if our nodejs can
> > >> >> handle it. Rollup might be needed only for compatibility with
> > >> >> older nodejs versions which we don't need to support.
> > >> >
> > >> >Unfortunately, it's not that simple.
> > >> >Short version: internal acorn *need* to be in commonjs format.
> > >>
> > >> OK, thanks for the explanation. We can, may be, file a wishlist
> > >> issue to support ES modules for internal acorn as well.
> > >>
> > >
> > >If upstream node switches to ES for internal modules, they'll do it
> > >for all of them i think. But it would not simplify anything, so i
> > >doubt they wil.
> >
> > Why would it not simplify? If nodejs can handle ES6 directly, then we
> > don't need to build acorn (we can use the esm source directly). So if
> > acorn don't build depend or depend on nodejs, we break the circular
> > build dependency.
>
> I guess Jérémy means that it would not simplify anything for _upstream_,
> if (as usual in the NodeJS ecosystem) what they depend on is not sources
> but products.
>
> If that's the point then I think it might still be worth a try to make
> the suggestion, pointing out benefits for downstrem users like Debian
> wanting to simplify bootstrappability - even if that's not generally a
> priority for NodeJS developers upstream.
>

Maybe we had a misunderstanding:
i will/am doing precisely that: loading "source" acorn using ESM from
internal nodejs builtins.
However that makes nodejs much slower to start - it has to read
*sequentially* all acorn
source files (around 20), and in that mode, it has to read all its internal
builtins ( ~ 260).
That's 280 files to load on start. Currently all those are packed and
loaded at once in /usr/bin/node.
Hence why i want to build a "slow" stage 1 nodejs then the normal build as
soon as acorn can
be repacked by rollup.

Jérémy
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